AAArrrgggghhhh front subframe.

[jpsmit]

Help!

Tonight was to be the night I reinstalled the front subframe - got it rolled into place, SWMBO graciously operated the jack and we elegantly and slowly raised it into place - top bolts went in a treat but I cannot get the back side bolts to fit.

I have managed to get one though I am not convinced the bushing is in properly. The other side has the bolt and subframe about 1/2 an inch (12 or so mm) behind the hole in the car.

what to do? I have tried prying it a bit, I have slacked off (and tightened the tops)

Looking at it, some things occur to me.

1. Is there a front and back to the top bushing bolt things? or are they symmetrical?

2. I have put up the subframe complete - ie hockey stick camber adjusters and roll bar - could these be over stiffening the frame slightly out of allignment?

3. Is there a chance that GT holes are differently located than SL holes?

I do feel like I shouldn't have to force it.

any thoughts?

thanks all

[lord13]

From what i remember these can either go in without a hitch...or be a complete pain in the a**, to my knowledge and experience with these the top mounts are symmetrical.
Have you fully tightened the top mounts? If so slacken them off a fair bit, this will allow the subframe to move around a little, a couple of mm play at the top mounts will translate to a fair amount at the bottom mounts. once you have one in alignment, slide a bolt or other such locating tool ( a screwdriver works) through it and pull/push/swear at the other one till you can something through that one too.
hope this helps

[1972nail]

As lord 13 says, the top bushes are symmetrical, the holes in the chassis are the same for all models and they are a real pain to fit!

I've found that having the top mount bolts, both the ones through the chassis leg and the ones through the bushes, a very loose, 'hanging' fit then the bottom bolts slide in easier. Prying with bars and screwdrivers also helps and the fact that the rear bolts have a tapered end allows you to tap them into place to help locate everything.

Only when all 4 mounting bolts are in do you tighten everything up.

[jpsmit]

Thanks so very much - and please keep the ideas coming

To clarify though the anti roll bar etc are not likely a factor?

[1972nail]

No, they will not affect the fitting of the subframe.

[droopsnoot]

I had exactly this problem on my Sportshatch. The key is to stick the top bolts in loose, and then install the gearbox cross-member. Apply a scissor jack, suitably spaced if required, between the end of the rear leg and the front of the crossmember, and push it forward until the holes line up. Then stick a bolt in quick.

The image shows after I'd managed to get a bolt in. At this point, I've got a spare crossmember in place, just for the jack to push against. It's a jack that came with a car, not quite a scissor jack, but in this case it helps as it wasn't in the way of the floor.

[Colin]

Off subject, but is there any chance of seeing any more pictures of your Sportshatch Mike? I know a huge amount of work has gone into it. Unfortunately nothing is showing on your website since the fotobucket phuckup...

Don't give up J.P! No problem is insurmountable.

[1972nail]

I had rebuilt my chassis rails around the bolt hole area many years ago using an old early 1159 OHV subframe as the guide for the distance between the chassis rails. When it came time to fit my rebuilt OHC subframe it was too wide....

On looking at the bodywork section of the workshop manual I noticed that there was quite a tolerance on the width of the subframes and my OHV subframe was at the narrowest end of the tolerance and the OHC one at the widest. A bit of cutting and re-welding was required.

So, back to this problem..... The bits will fit but because of the very wide production tolerances there are a lot of various permutations of how easily it will fit.

[jpsmit]

Thanks for all of this I truly appreciate it! Mike, sorry but can you explain how the gearbox cross member is relevant to this? I genuinely don't understand.

After some reflection, I realized that the subframe will have to come out at least once more, so, for now since it is only to locate the brake lines, three bolts is enough.

OTOH It seems that when the time comes (soon I hope) that it might make more sense to install the engine from above as trying to do this with the subframe alone is hard enough never mind the engine!

thoughts?

[1972nail]

I think Mike was using the gearbos cross member as a jacking point to jack the subfram forward to align with the bolt holes. I would fit the subframe with the engine installed. I must upload the missing photobucket photos to my thread to show how I did it.