gt poss engine convsersion choices

[mattgill]

i am starting to come to the viva owners club way of thinking if i am honest 2300 may be the way forward, red top idea put to bed now lotus a small possibilty do these go in real easy then

[oli8925]

Good stuff. As miserable as everyone here is it does make sense. The thing I don't get about this particular Redtop conversion is you will end up with an HB with a Redtop, it will no longer be a GT. So why not do it to the slightly more common and less valuable 1159cc HB and save money and a genuine GT by selling this on? While I understand conversions to an extent, I don't understand doing it to a car as rare and valuable as the GT is to Vivas. It just seems to be entirely the wrong choice in my head. Bu that's opinions for you.

I also don't buy into the Redtop thing. They're common, mostly knackered and mistreated, and are pretty average really. The advantage of them is they're everywhere and fairly cheap, which I can see being a great advantage in something like a Nova or Corsa where the conversion is well known and you can buy parts off the shelf (Opel even do a conversion guide for them!), but in a Viva the amount of custom work involved negates the ease and cheapness of the engine. There are better, more suited engines to choose, but last time I slagged off the Redtop I got pounced on by a fanboi so I'm leaving it at that.

The 2.3/Lotus would be easier, cheaper (probably), kinder to the cars originality and vintage (easily reversible and no chopping), much more period and likeable over a Redtop' and I bet you more fun even if it isn't as fast. I'd rather have a mid-tuned Slant 4 over a C20Zzzzzzz anyday.

[mattgill]

i do not know anything about the lotus engine really and am a bit scared of parts availability for an old engine i do know about xe's trust me they are really really good engines when mildly tuned and in good condition, but i am look out for a 2300 for now till i gather more information may leave it at that who knows

[GTpete]

I would consider a 2.4 Vauxhall Frontera engine, fitted with Opel Manta sump/fuel injection system easy 150 bhp with a cam change....

[bikingnutcase0]

I've just read this thread (was browsing the forum looking for wheel offset data, and gearbox info...) and stumbled upon this. Re the third post- Omg, all the legislation is a bit worrying isn't it?!?! The Euro fun police are really on it at the moment aren't they? I've read the INF26 document, about the eight-point system-

Vehicles that have been radically altered-
This covers vehicles which are radically altered from their original specification, but which are not kit conversions.
In these cases, the vehicle components from the original vehicle will be given a number of points. To keep the original registration number, the vehicle must have eight or more points, which must include the original or new unmodified chassis or monocoque bodyshell.
If the vehicle has less than eight points, a second-hand or altered chassis, frame or monocoque bodyshell is used, the vehicle must have IVA, SVA or MSVA, whichever is appropriate, so that it can be registered. A ‘Q’ registration number will then be issued, (see section 7.)
The following points will be given to the original major components used.

n Chassis or monocoque bodyshell (body and chassis as one unit) (original or new)* 5
n Suspension (front & back) 2
n Axles (both) 2
n Transmission 2
n Steering assembly 2
n Engine 1

I have a ratty 1256 HC estate I was planning to tidy up, put a diesel into and use as a daily drive (for 15p a litre biodiesel-fuelled motoring). What I've gleaned from all of this is that my plan to swap engine and box for diesel and later-model box, fit a Jensen-Healey (vauxhall magnum) axle (to withstand the extra diesel torque), and put newer uprated springs, bushes and shocks (suspension, according to the INF26?), and later astra 236mm disks and pads (vented and readily availiable spares), will put me dangerously close to requiring an IVA and new reg no.

If it gets to that point I suppose I'll simply have to claim the back axle is original, and the springs and dampers are just brand new replacements, hence giving me 11points and forgoing the need for a Q-plate. Ridiculous.

[pbottomley]

n Chassis or monocoque bodyshell (body and chassis as one unit) (original or new)* 5
n Suspension (front & back) 2
n Axles (both) 2
n Transmission 2
n Steering assembly 2
n Engine 1

I have a ratty 1256 HC estate I was planning to tidy up, put a diesel into and use as a daily drive (for 15p a litre biodiesel-fuelled motoring). What I've gleaned from all of this is that my plan to swap engine and box for diesel and later-model box, fit a Jensen-Healey (vauxhall magnum) axle (to withstand the extra diesel torque), and put newer uprated springs, bushes and shocks (suspension, according to the INF26?), and later astra 236mm disks and pads (vented and readily availiable spares), will put me dangerously close to requiring an IVA and new reg no.

If it gets to that point I suppose I'll simply have to claim the back axle is original, and the springs and dampers are just brand new replacements, hence giving me 11points and forgoing the need for a Q-plate. Ridiculous.

Right, well these regs have been in place 28 or so years now, and I am glad for once someone has read them and now understands the problem of just "doing my own thing".

In many cases folks choose to ignore these regs, but in the last few years this has become more difficult with the online nature of information such as insurance details and DVLA records, being easy to cross-reference for errors and getting yourself caught.

BUT if you plan things right you should be able to fit the engine and still keep it within the rules. Dont cut the shell (gearbox will be fun) consider keeping the standard axle (good for 100bhp) and fit larger rear wheels in order to up the gearing, uprate the brakes as suggested.

[bikingnutcase0]

Well I was sort of aware of them, but hadn't previously considered their application to relatively standard vehicles, I'd just sort of vaugely imagined ford pop's with jag rear ends and yank v8's hanging outta the front would need one and anything less was more or less acceptable.

As you say though, a bit of forethought and common sense should allow me to avoid falling foul. Transmission tunnel will be the only real stumbling block. Perhaps some veeeery light "relieving" with some panel-beating hammers and spoons, and mounting it as low as possible will enable me to get away with it! And I guess the new shocks, springs and bushes would be considered a "repair" as opposed to a modification. I think (controversially!) I'll risk using the magnum/firenza axle. Although it's reassurring to know the 1256 axle is ok for 100bhp, I worry that although the diesel will put out only 100bhp or less, it could be up to 180lbf-ft torque instead of the 80-100lbf-ft you might get from a 100bhp petrol engine, and I dont want to be swapping worn-out axles every six months, or picking fragments of pinion gear up off the road lol!

There were obviously brand-new vehicles that left the factory in that configuration, and only a seriously dedicated vauxhall officionado would ever know, only the 9" instead of 8" drums, a few slightly different webs in the cast housing, and slightly different length upper arms visually set it apart, it's not like I'm bolting a narrowed 9" ford axle in there or anything! In any case if it did come to light and cause issue I would argue that the IVA is designed to replace manufacturer's type approval, but a viva estate with 2300 axle was already type-approved by vauxhall back in the seventies with the "Magnum" range. After re-reading it I noticed that brakes (unless counted as part of the "Axle" assembly I suppose.......) aren't mentioned.

It's a minefield, I've always found (with modified bikes I I used to build/ride) that requirements for M.O.T, registration (I.V.A and S.V.A/M.S.V.A), and construction and use regulations don't always necessaraly tie up very well!

I'm so glad I've found vauxhallviva.com, any question I have needed answering so far has been answered by nothing more than a quick browse of the threads on the forum, as usually somebody has already asked it (or if not someone on droopsnootgroup!) And thankyou for your input! I think I may need the luck you wished me..........

[MattyE]

Hi Mr Nutcase!

I Like your way of thinking! i myself have recently considered buying a cheap diesel astra as a winter hack to save my already crusty firenza daily driver from the dreaded winter road salt!

Possibly in the summer the aforementioned diesel lump may make its way into my project magnum.. so that ive got at least one car that has both cool factor and economy.. enabling me to cast the idea of economy from my mind when the firenza gets its (eventual and much deserved) resto/mod

Definatley change the axle for a magnum axle... there is a thread on retrorides where a chap named B8D has put an 1.7 Isuzu DTI in a viva estate retaining the 1256 axle and subsequently blowing apart a planet gear!

if your going down this route its definatley worth a read of his build thread!

as i see it youve got

Shell = 5
Steering = 2
Springy Shocky bits (Im assuming like you that unless you change the way it works (eg to coilovers) etc then new springs and shocks count as replacement not modified)= 2

there is your 9 points, job done

[hbpeter]

B8D is also on here, thread somewhere. His diesel engine does have a rather large turbo fitted, not the standard one. Theres also clips on youtube.

Welcome Mr Nutcase, keep us informed and lets have lots of pictures.

Peter

[bikingnutcase0]

I have seen B8D's Viva estate build on RetroRides, although I had come up with the idea before I was aware someone had already done it! I saw he destroyed his planet gears, although his is massively tuned, and driven hard lol! I'm in chippenham, and he's bath/bristol way so not too far, I may have to message him and ask what he did for a sump.......

I also have an isuzu 1.7td for mine, may get mildly tweaked and different turbo (not that it needs it, mine came without turbocharger sadly, and I have some others lying around that will work, its just a choice of which one!)

I have a corsa with 1.5td isuzu in it, it's quite rapid with 1.2bar boost and lots of additional fuel! However I have put four f13/f15 gearboxes into it in four years, finally admitted defeat and fitted a stonger f16 close-ratio a month ago. But that's convinced me to go with strong transmission from the outset for the Viva!

I'm seriously looking forward to having a pretty looking car with real character and proper-wheel drive, instead of horrible-looking front-drive shopping trolley cars, but keeping my biodiesel-fuelled 15pence a litre motoring! It's the way forward, I'm convinced!

I'll start a thread very soon (and stop posting my inner thoughts on old threads!), and plaster the new thread with pictures! Maybe someone will recognise my car, it's burgandy, came off'f the 'bay from southampton way. Bit crusty round the edges but nothing a bit of a tickle with a mig, and some 'glass wings won't fix, the monocoque seems relatively sound (sounder than my sh*tbox corsa anyway!).

I'm glad people approve, my girlfriend thinks I'm gonna ruin it, but I said to her I can either have a pristine classic mothballed somewhere forgotten about, or modernise one a little with diesel and 5-speed box and enjoy the heck out of it every day, cause it'll cost nothing in fuel, drive comfortably, and start every time I turn the key!