Is my viva overpriced?

[1972nail]

With this argument we need to move on a few years. Yes, a few years ago a Viva was a 'first' car for many and a cheap run around but today the Corsa fills that void. A few years ago we aspired to get a sportier saloon for our next car like a Firenza, Magnum, Crapee or Manta, today the 3 Series BMW or the sportier Astras etc fullfil that role. The Classic Car scene is moving away from Classics to 'Retros'.....cars that look a bit like an old car but perform like a modern sports saloon.

Our Vivas are caught some where in the middle at the minute with 3 types of buyer. We have the would be 'Retro brigade' want to buy them and fit a RedTop, V8 or Turbo Slab etc but the majority don't have the skills or budget to do so properly. They are willing to pay a higher than reasonable price, get the engine out.... then reality hits.......and the car is left unfinished and they have moved on to a Vectra or something.

These higher than reasonable prices are deterring the 'Classic profiteer' owner who wants to buy a car with a bit of leeway to spend some money on it and get a return. Our cars aren't desireable enough to make this a viable propisition for most, unless they are experienced Viva owners and have lots of secondhand parts at their disposal or they buy it for next to nothing.

The 3rd group are those who want a Classic to enjoy for a few summers. They want a car with little work to get it to a reasonable show condition, drive it at the weekends and everyone says 'what a lovely old car'. They want to pay a reasonable or slightly higher price for the right car, they want a car they can drive away from the vendor and they want a car that looks good.

At the minute, I think anyway, that this car should be aimed to appeal at the 3rd type of owner and should be prepared for and advertised to that market. That means fixing the clutch and making it a reliable driver.

[Fred Dukes]

Here endeth the lesson by St David - well put together Dave - about covers all the angles - lets hope the type 1 buyer focus on a cheaper 80's 90's platforms to express themselves (or not!!) and leave the remaining few Viva/Firenza/Magnums in one piece to maintains the heritage.

[AccieMad]

Headlining isnt as bad as you think. Go slowly lots of bulldog clips and you'll improve the car no end.

You'll need a nice hot day so it is nice and tight when it cools off.

Prices have gone mad but that's life. I bought my HB for £350 a decade or more ago running and just needed a horn for the MoT. Cant get anything for anywhere near that now. I think there are two 4 door HB SLs left. Hence why they are rare and hold more value. Condition is *everything*

Good luck.

[Kraken]

I think there are two 4 door HB SLs left. Hence why they are rare and hold more value. Condition is *everything*

I have a large collection of 4-door HB SL dust

[HC Fairley]

I know what you're both saying, but if they were still a £500 car they would all be getting bangered! On the other extreme there is a hb on ebay for nearly 7k... Everyone has jumped on the classic car bandwagon, making old cars out of reach for most people.

Only reason I own a viva was because it was a £500 car. Sure it needs a bit of restoration work but I can't imagine I'd have paid much more for it.

[Colin]

Whether we like it or not classic 'ordinary' cars like our Vivas have all increased in value. The same inflation also affects the other proletarian marques - Austin, Morris, Hillman and Chrysler - together with of course the more prosaic Dagenham dustbins.

High values are caused by market forces. Good old fashioned supply and demand. If a commodity is in high demand and is scarce, then prices will inevitably rise. So if you happen to find an original, unmolested, delivery mileage Escort Twin Cam, bought new in 1968 and squirreled away in a garden shed by your granddad when it was six months old, you can more or less name your price. This is because demand is extremely high and the commodity is extremely scarce.

Demand with classic cars is usually generated by sporting pedigree (and sometimes to a lesser degree by fashion fads eg, Fiat 500, Heinkel bubble car) - hence a World Championship winning 1960s formula 1 Ferrari can now be valued in probably tens of millions. For this reason it's only the rarer sporting Escorts and Cortinas - those associated with sporting success - ie; Lotus Twin Cam, RS 1600 / 2000 and Mexico that command stupid £50k plus prices. Your old Zodiac can still be had for a couple of grand. Closer to our world the same basic principles apply; a good HS Chevette is going to be worth literally ten times the value of a good 1256 four door Chevette saloon in similar condition. A good HPF ten times the value of a 1256 four door HC Viva.

These supply and demand / sporting pedigree / fashion principles apply to all of our old cars to a greater or lesser degree, usually depending upon the how closely the car can be associated with sporting success and how close it is to new original condition. Thus a two door (slightly 'sportier' than four door) HB Viva in immaculate condition can now command a price tag in several thousands. And one bearing a 'Brabham' badge gets the dealers more excited than a vicar let loose in Soho, even though they don't know what they're buying or trying to sell. The appeal is in the perceived 'sporting pedigree'.

Yes, it's stupid, but because our old cars were considered worthless for so many years there are now only a very few left. And so, as an increasingly scarce commodity, they're not likely to depreciate any time soon. If your £3000 HB isn't selling just at this moment, Steve, be patient. It will soon.

[yoeddynz]

I agree. Viva prices are on the rise and will continue to do so. They are getting rarer. Supply and demand plus they are a very usable cheap to run daily classic that many people have a connection with.

I don't mind the values going up at all. I have my two Vivas. If they go up in value and one day I sell either for more than I paid then great! I'll never get back all the time Ive spent fixing or modifying mine though but its a hobby and I enjoy it so it doesn't matter.

Anyway- Nail missed the fourth category of Viva owner... the ones who actually only have Vivas as their daily. Maybe not many in the UK because of winter salt? But here in NZ there are a few about alongside many others who daily an old car. Cheap easy motoring and why not ? Then you get true value from your classic car. A daily that is going up in value whilst providing smiles for all